September 18, 2021
Lincoln, Slavery, and the North
Timothy Birdnow
Chester McAteer and I were discussing Lincoln and the Civil War.
Chet observes:
What few people know is that Lincoln was a leader of the American Colonization Society, who's stated goal was to rid White America of all non-whites, deporting every man, woman and child from these shores both slave and free. One of his friends, instrumental in his election, was Hilton Helper. Helper wrote two books that were the political Bibles of the Radical Republican Party. One was titled The Negro in Negroland, in it Helper advocated the complete extermination of the Black race. Lincoln awarded Helper a high Consultant position in Argentina for his assistance with his election efforts.
"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, -that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
--Lincoln
"There is a natural disgust in the minds of nearly all white people to the idea of indiscriminate amalgamation of the white and black races ... A separation of the races is the only perfect prevention of amalgamation, but as an immediate separation is impossible, the next best thing is to keep them apart where they are not already together.†--Lincoln
"Our republican system was meant for a homogeneous people. As long as blacks continue to live with the whites they constitute a threat to national life. Family life may also collapse and the increase of mixed breed bastards may some day challenge the supremacy of the white man.â€
--Lincoln
"I have no purpose directly or indirectly to interfere with the institution of slavery in the states where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so.â€
--Lincoln
Tim adds:
Yeah; Lincoln was NOT an integrationist by any stretch (which is probably why he is in disfavor with the BLM crowd.)
You know, one of the proposals late in the war was for the South to rejoin the Union and then a united army of Confederate and Union led jointly by Lee and Grant would invade Mexico, then we would send all the freed slaves there. It came to nothing but it's interersting in that it was what was being kicked around at that time Chet. No doubt Lincoln would have blessed such a venture.
Chet replies:
That's the great mistake of our time, we place our current moralising on the past and a very common opinion. The fact is that no one was an Intergrationist
The Northern States passed exclusion laws that made it hard or impossible for freed Slaves to enter or settle in their jurisdictions. Massachusetts passed laws that allowed the flogging of blacks that remained in the State over 2 months, Indiana’s constitution stated, "no negro or mulatto shall come into or settle in the state. Most of the Northern States crafted similar laws and imposed harsh penalties on freed or runaway Slaves. John Sherman, William Tecumseh’s brother declared in 1862 that: "We do not like the negroes. We do not disguise our dislike. As my friend from Indiana said yesterday: The whole people of the Northwestern States are opposed to having many negroes among them and that principle or prejudice has been engraved in the legislation for nearly all the Northwestern States.â€
A British observer, Captain Fremantle witnessed an unusual site in a captured Northern town, he states that he saw a Confederate soldier leading a captured Union soldier down the street all alone, but the strange part of it was that the Confederate soldier was black. He went on to say: "This little episode of a Southern slave leading a white Yankee soldier through a Northern village, alone and on his own accord, would not have been gratifying to an abolitionist, nor would the sympathizers both in England and in the North feel encouraged if they could hear the language of detestation and contempt with which the numerous Negroes with Southern armies speak of their [Northern] liberators.â€
Another shocker is to read just how Unionist armies treated Slaves in conquered territories of the South. It was, to be restrained, despicable, to say the least. Not to mention the general atrocities committed by Union armies on the general population of the South.
Reading the Census data of 1860, the North repealed the possibility of free black immigration. In that year the black population in the North was 1.7%, strange that there was so little migration allowed into the North if the North was so concerned with the plight of Slaves. Do some research and find out just how the freed Slave were treated in the North, then read the Slave Chronicles and see how they were treated, for the most part, in the South.
Another amazing fact is that Robert E. Lee and others called for the immediate emancipation of all Slaves, while there were those like Jefferson Davis who believed that it was the responsibility of Slave owners to educate and prepare them for freedom. Everyone in the South knew that the economic reality of Slavery was rapidly diminishing long before Secession and the War and would have probably been completely economically unviable by 1870 due to progress in agricultural machinery. Jefferson Davis stated that no matter who won the War, that Slavery would eventually become a defunct institution. The concern of many in the South was the method of emancipation. In the writings of Jefferson Davis you will find he was of the opinion that the slaves should be well prepared for freedom; that they should be educated and made aware of the responsibility of freedom. Instead, the War of Northern Aggression released the slaves into a life filled with generational poverty, hatred and hardship. If you read the Slave Chronicles you will see that many former slaves felt that they were recklessly thrown into a freedom that was far from free.
In a Confederate soldier’s journal was found the following words: "I was a soldier in Virginia in the campaigns of Lee and Jackson, and I declare I never met a Southern soldier who had drawn his sword to perpetuate slavery. What he had chiefly at heart was the preservation of the supreme and sacred right of self-government
So many volunteered to fight for the Confederacy that thousands initially had to be forced to return home instead. Can you imagine anyone fighting a War for an institution such as Slavery when the vast majority of the Southern population had no connection with slavery and never owned a slave? They fought for something far more valiant, far more noble and that was the same cause that inspired the Declaration of Independence in 1776.
Chester McAteer and I were discussing Lincoln and the Civil War.
Chet observes:
What few people know is that Lincoln was a leader of the American Colonization Society, who's stated goal was to rid White America of all non-whites, deporting every man, woman and child from these shores both slave and free. One of his friends, instrumental in his election, was Hilton Helper. Helper wrote two books that were the political Bibles of the Radical Republican Party. One was titled The Negro in Negroland, in it Helper advocated the complete extermination of the Black race. Lincoln awarded Helper a high Consultant position in Argentina for his assistance with his election efforts.
"I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, -that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."
--Lincoln
"There is a natural disgust in the minds of nearly all white people to the idea of indiscriminate amalgamation of the white and black races ... A separation of the races is the only perfect prevention of amalgamation, but as an immediate separation is impossible, the next best thing is to keep them apart where they are not already together.†--Lincoln
"Our republican system was meant for a homogeneous people. As long as blacks continue to live with the whites they constitute a threat to national life. Family life may also collapse and the increase of mixed breed bastards may some day challenge the supremacy of the white man.â€
--Lincoln
"I have no purpose directly or indirectly to interfere with the institution of slavery in the states where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so.â€
--Lincoln
Tim adds:
Yeah; Lincoln was NOT an integrationist by any stretch (which is probably why he is in disfavor with the BLM crowd.)
You know, one of the proposals late in the war was for the South to rejoin the Union and then a united army of Confederate and Union led jointly by Lee and Grant would invade Mexico, then we would send all the freed slaves there. It came to nothing but it's interersting in that it was what was being kicked around at that time Chet. No doubt Lincoln would have blessed such a venture.
Chet replies:
That's the great mistake of our time, we place our current moralising on the past and a very common opinion. The fact is that no one was an Intergrationist
The Northern States passed exclusion laws that made it hard or impossible for freed Slaves to enter or settle in their jurisdictions. Massachusetts passed laws that allowed the flogging of blacks that remained in the State over 2 months, Indiana’s constitution stated, "no negro or mulatto shall come into or settle in the state. Most of the Northern States crafted similar laws and imposed harsh penalties on freed or runaway Slaves. John Sherman, William Tecumseh’s brother declared in 1862 that: "We do not like the negroes. We do not disguise our dislike. As my friend from Indiana said yesterday: The whole people of the Northwestern States are opposed to having many negroes among them and that principle or prejudice has been engraved in the legislation for nearly all the Northwestern States.â€
A British observer, Captain Fremantle witnessed an unusual site in a captured Northern town, he states that he saw a Confederate soldier leading a captured Union soldier down the street all alone, but the strange part of it was that the Confederate soldier was black. He went on to say: "This little episode of a Southern slave leading a white Yankee soldier through a Northern village, alone and on his own accord, would not have been gratifying to an abolitionist, nor would the sympathizers both in England and in the North feel encouraged if they could hear the language of detestation and contempt with which the numerous Negroes with Southern armies speak of their [Northern] liberators.â€
Another shocker is to read just how Unionist armies treated Slaves in conquered territories of the South. It was, to be restrained, despicable, to say the least. Not to mention the general atrocities committed by Union armies on the general population of the South.
Reading the Census data of 1860, the North repealed the possibility of free black immigration. In that year the black population in the North was 1.7%, strange that there was so little migration allowed into the North if the North was so concerned with the plight of Slaves. Do some research and find out just how the freed Slave were treated in the North, then read the Slave Chronicles and see how they were treated, for the most part, in the South.
Another amazing fact is that Robert E. Lee and others called for the immediate emancipation of all Slaves, while there were those like Jefferson Davis who believed that it was the responsibility of Slave owners to educate and prepare them for freedom. Everyone in the South knew that the economic reality of Slavery was rapidly diminishing long before Secession and the War and would have probably been completely economically unviable by 1870 due to progress in agricultural machinery. Jefferson Davis stated that no matter who won the War, that Slavery would eventually become a defunct institution. The concern of many in the South was the method of emancipation. In the writings of Jefferson Davis you will find he was of the opinion that the slaves should be well prepared for freedom; that they should be educated and made aware of the responsibility of freedom. Instead, the War of Northern Aggression released the slaves into a life filled with generational poverty, hatred and hardship. If you read the Slave Chronicles you will see that many former slaves felt that they were recklessly thrown into a freedom that was far from free.
In a Confederate soldier’s journal was found the following words: "I was a soldier in Virginia in the campaigns of Lee and Jackson, and I declare I never met a Southern soldier who had drawn his sword to perpetuate slavery. What he had chiefly at heart was the preservation of the supreme and sacred right of self-government
So many volunteered to fight for the Confederacy that thousands initially had to be forced to return home instead. Can you imagine anyone fighting a War for an institution such as Slavery when the vast majority of the Southern population had no connection with slavery and never owned a slave? They fought for something far more valiant, far more noble and that was the same cause that inspired the Declaration of Independence in 1776.
Posted by: Timothy Birdnow at
12:07 PM
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1
Just goes to show that the stuff they taught us in school years ago was, how shall I say it, whitewashed?
It's pretty well known that Lincoln didn't think the two "races" should live in proximity to each other. It's nice that history has proven him wrong, otherwise we'd not have had Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. as someone to look up to; also Thomas Sowell and Walter Williams, among many others.
And the new black heroine, Nicki Minaj, who has come out in favor of thinking for yourself, researching the situation and drawing your own conclusions -- with both guns blazing. I predict we haven't heard the last of this gal!
It's pretty well known that Lincoln didn't think the two "races" should live in proximity to each other. It's nice that history has proven him wrong, otherwise we'd not have had Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. as someone to look up to; also Thomas Sowell and Walter Williams, among many others.
And the new black heroine, Nicki Minaj, who has come out in favor of thinking for yourself, researching the situation and drawing your own conclusions -- with both guns blazing. I predict we haven't heard the last of this gal!
Posted by: Dana Mathewson at September 18, 2021 05:03 PM (lydPE)
2
It is true Dana; history is written by the victors and we got a sanitized version of it. There was so very much more to the story.
Yeah; had we followed Lincoln our world would be so much the poorer for it.
I haven't heard of her; I'll have to look her up!
Yeah; had we followed Lincoln our world would be so much the poorer for it.
I haven't heard of her; I'll have to look her up!
Posted by: Timothy Birdnow at September 19, 2021 06:35 AM (1cFnK)
3
She's a rapper, and frankly, her stuff isn't very good. But she has thousands of followers on her Instagram account, so she influences a lot of people. And she's what we used to call "easy on the eyes."
Posted by: Dana Mathewson at September 19, 2021 09:11 AM (lydPE)
4
Well good for her! I hope she influences a lot of young people to start using their topnot.
Posted by: Timothy Birdnow at September 20, 2021 07:26 AM (FihTO)
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