May 25, 2021
Arguing with Idiots Economics Edition
Timothy Birdnow
In a discussion on Facebook a guy named Sebastian Clay Kinsey makes the following claim about taxation, claiming it won't drive business away:
Republican short-sightedness. Any company that leaves will be instantly replaced by a new one, especially with a population full of cash to go spend on a daily basis. Repubs always think one-step ahead & nothing more.
I replied:
Sebastian Clay Kinsey history proves you wrong; just look at how many corporations left during the NAFTA era. You have a nice faculty lounge theory but the real world explodes it.
David Redfern replies:
Where were all these 'replacement' businesses to fill the holes when US manufacturers went to China?
Where's the equivalent Apple, Dell, IBM and Motorola factories producing phones, laptops and TV's?
Where are all the textile manufacturers to replace those that moved production to India and China?
Then there's white goods and kitchen appliances. Whirlpool imported 2,368 different products from China in 2019/2020.
Why would a US business not take advantage of Chinese wages which are pennies on the dollar? Especially when they have to pay exorbitant corporation Taxes.
socialists can't think one step ahead.
Mr. Kinsey says:
David Redfern... you don't understand how these things work. It's a theory of specialization.
David Redfern replies:
You said it mate: "It's a theory of specialization.
Clearly you have not read Adam Smith who was amongst the first, and by far and away the most famous to quantify the concept of specialisation.
It's nothing new, as Matt Ridley points out in his book The rational Optimist. Mankind began specialising shortly after discovering the concept of free trade.
This is not a 1950's concept, nor an 1850's, 1650's or 1150's concept; it goes back to the dawn of time, when a guy realised he was a lousy fisherman, but could make great hooks. He teamed up with a guy who could fish but was a lousy hook maker. They specialised, traded and prospered. The concept is not unique to fishing of course.
The concept can be traced back through time by Anthropologists
It can also be applied to every single manufacturer and profitable trading operation throughout the world, over time, including the present day. It all works on the same principle.
Trump understands the concept intimately because he is a businessmen. Biden, the Clintons and Bernie don't understand it because they have been politicians all their life and have never had a real job in that time. And to be fair, most career politicians are the same.
What did Trump do to "hobble future tech, modern energy production, educating our public to perform 1st world tasks, etc..."?
He encouraged businesses to return to the US by lowering Corporation Tax so jobs would be created. That increases receipts from income, local and purchase Taxes, and all the benefits to society that cascade from that like infrastructure improvement.
And what modern energy sources are you referring to. Trump was a supporter of Nuclear power and was taking an active interest in SMR's (Small Modular Reactors) an energy source even the most committed green, Michael Shellenberger, supports in his recent book Apocalypse Never (Why Environmental Alarmism Hurts Us All).
As for education, Trump was attempting to improve educational choice, supported home schooling, and was attempting to hand authority back to individual states for education that reflected their regional priorities instead of the one size fits all, centralised DC governance. This required an overhaul of the Carl D. Perkins Career and Technical Education Act. Spending $1.2 billion on a program last overhauled by Congress in 2006. His Title I aid was typically directed at low-income students.
Trump improved employment and wages across Women, Blacks, Hispanics and Asians. More Tax receipts for the country from participants utterly ignored by Obama. Again, another theorist career politician with no understanding of Free Trade because he had never encountered it before.
Trumps only mistake was the vocalisation of his desire to Drain The Swamp. It had every corrupt politician from both sides of the house mounting smear campaigns against him via the MSM who were in on the Swamp up to their armpits.
Like any other country on the planet, America is a giant business. Who better to get it functioning properly than a demonstrably effective businessman? Certainly not a bunch of Crony Capitalist politicians desperate to milk the country for as much as possible, for as long as possible.
And Kinsey again:
David Redfern... first off, not a bad post. But Trump is the antithesis off what he cons people into thinking. He's no businessman. He's a con-man & a scam artist. Every "business" he's had has either been a scam, or a ploy he kept temporarily alive by bankfraud, ripping off partners.... or in a few cases, something he drive into the ground sheer stupidity, greed & business practices that made him the laughing stock of the comercial world. A country is NOT A BUSINESS.... this idea is the most absurd concept. I've heard it for years and it's just rubbish. A country is somewhat similar to a family.... and almost nothing like a business in actuality. The employment lies Trump would tout, fell into his lap... so like any con-man, he tried to sell them as his doing. 8 years of pro-middle class polÃcies is what turned the tidev in that direction - the trickledown fantasy you believe in had been proven time & time again to be a con-job. Half these corporations weasel out of taxes & pay Trump-like cronies (his entire crooked admin of thieves & pay to play criminals) to bypass all regulations in place to create SUSTAINABLE growth... not the smash & grab thievery we saw under that orange sociopath. Corporate taxes were already the lowest in the developed world, while the middle class is underwater & getting worse. Trumps education idea was basic... give it over to that Trump donor, DeVos... and her criminal billionaire family so they could profiteer off of private scamsc posing as education... sucking cash out of American tax payers to line their own pockets, promote Christian schools of nonsense, and leave American youth further behind the rest of the world more & more every day.
You bought into these lying, scum thieves. Yeah, politics isn't perfect... but I'll take the average 15% liar instead of the 99% liar any day of the week. Politics is complicated... there's a REASON career politicians exist. You think an army of corrupt scum is your salvation bcuz they're willing to lie to you non-stop & tell you what you want to hear, while robbing you blind from the back. Good lord dude.... do you think it's a coincidence that everyone that knows Trump hates his guts eventually? It ain't bcuz he's "calling it like it is". I'd vote for you as president a million times before that orange painted monster. You may be incorrect about everything but unlike Trump, you prolly genuinely care & would figure stuff out as you went. You want a successful nation? Take care of the middlec class... and the rest of it happens naturally.
(Editor's note: notice how desperate this guy has become since David pinned him? He is now ranting.)
David retorts:
And yet, Trump managed to build hotels etc. across the world with people who evidently trust him.
Trust is an inherent part of business, without a reputation for delivering, no one will deal with you.
Had Trump been as unscrupulous as you maintain, no one would do business with him. Yours is just typical TDS, you don't like the man (nor did I) and are unwilling to face facts (I am).
How does a family survive if not through running its own micro business. 'Money in' must exceed 'money out' or the family goes bust and loses their home, car and all their worldly goods.
Manage a families finances well and you are running a small business, even down to the individual level.
A country is no different. Money in must exceed money out to realise a profit and a healthy balance of trade. Trump was bringing business back home so the balance of trade would shift back to the US and positively influence that money in/money out equation.
There is no other way of dealing with national debt other than by following those simple rules.
socialists and politicians in general don't understand how to achieve this fundamental equation, that's why far too many countries are wallowing in debt.
I have been forced to explain the concept of specialisation to you, must I really be forced to school you on the function of the most basic economics?
The rest of your post is just an unsubstantiated
Trump put together the clearest pre election manifesto I have ever seen, basically bullet point of promises he made to his voters. And unlike any politician before or since, he began ticking them off one by one. This is the reason I changed my mind about him. You can accuse him of what you want but at the very least he was honest with the people that voted for him and kept his promises as best he could.
Try examining any other politicians pre election manifesto, if they even produce a written copy by which they can be measured. They are without exception, vague nonsense wrapped up in reams of garbage telling people more about what they can't achieve rather than what they can.
Trump was also the most peaceful POTUS in living memory. All of his predecessors began at least one new international conflict in their first term. Trump started none.
By comparison, Trump faced down the N. Koreans and was admired by Putin as someone not to fuck with. And remember, this is Russia, the biggest country on earth by far, which abandoned communism for Capitalism yet has been demonised somehow, as a pariah state. Trump and Putin had one thing in common, an inherent distrust of the Chinese and a Democratic Russia could have been one of America's greatest allies. Contrast that with the utter disdain Putin treated Obama with, it was palpable in their recorded meetings. I have a friend who has lived in Russia for 30 years who confirms all this.
Furthermore, during Trumps tenure there was no unrest in the Middle east between Israel and Palestine. Indeed, Trump was in the midst of agreeing a monumental peace deal, notably by excluding Palestine from negotiations. Something no other peace deal has attempted or achieved.
Within weeks of Biden taken office he lifted monetary sanctions on Iran, handing them $billions, and the Palestinians attacked Israel. Coincidence? Not a chance.
Going from the sublime to the ridiculous, after Biden insulted Putin by acknowledging his as a 'killer', he was mocked by Putin who challenged him to a stair climbing competition and a public debate, both of which Biden declined with feeble excuses.
Biden betrayed 11,000 pipeline workers on his first day by sacking them. That wasn't in his pre election manifesto, was it? Now the country faces the prospect of returning to transporting Oil by trains and Warren Buffett is a major player in the railroad side of oil-by-rail. Berkshire Hathaway has full ownership of BNSF Railway Company, and BNSF is the biggest railroad player in the Bakken oil region.
Tell me that's not Crony Capitalism and that only 15% of sleepy Joe was lying.
But Trump said hurty things on Twitter.
FFS get some perspective.
I retort:
Sebastian Clay Kinsey you say "Republican efforts to hobble future tech, modern energy production, educating our public to perform 1st world tasks, etc"
How so? Where have the Republicans hobbled "future tech?" It is the Democrats who promote old technology like windmills. And solar, well, it doesn't really work and the Chinese own the materials needed to make solar power right now. I do not think you can support that claim. The Republicans favor nuclear and fracking for energy. The Republicans also are the ones who favor actual STEM education and not promote "Woke" theories like Math being racist. Or did you miss that?
What you call "short sighted" is an attempt to avoid wasting time and money and brains on foolish ideas like sustainability, or intersectionality.
The fact is we have lost a good deal of industry to China because of bad political decisions. It was decided in the '90's that China would be the industrial heart and the U.S. the tech sector. Well, a tech sector is wonderful but you still need to be able to actually make stuff, which is what the modern thinking fails to take into account. As long as you have to buy from overseas you are vulnerable, as the last twenty years SHOULD have taught us.
Rare Earth metals are a case in point. The Chinese have cornered the market on them. Now if we want to make all that dandy solar and wind stuff we have to go hat in hand to China.
I would add that we can manufacture things here in America that are better than what the Chinese are making, which means people will buy them even if they cost a bit more. You assume there is no difference in quality between what we and they produce. It's not true. I own a television that was made 100% in America and it was not considerably more expensive than a foreign made one. It's a lot better. People will choose quality if given the chance.
And the model of exporting jobs to Third World countries is not "sustainable" insofar as it will always lead to a search for cheaper and cheaper labor to exploit. The end result is the rise of the megacorporation and multinational entities and the demise of smaller local companies. This is terrible destructive.
Overly cheap labor is destructive. Slavery in the antebellum south proved that; it depressed wages in industries outside of those where slaves predominated (like cotton). There was a reason the old south was dirt poor except a few very wealthy planters and the like. By promoting China and other such serf labor we are guaranteeing a depression of American wages. There are only so many new tech jobs to go around. And what makes you think these tech jobs wont wind up being outsourced?
Why has Japan been in such bad economic shape for the last twenty years? In the '80's they were expected to be the big economic powerhouse. They did what you are proposing, went "high tech" and let the fundamentals slide. You have to make stuff to have a balanced economy. Fail to do that and you are at the mercy of others who can outbid you.
I fear YOU are the one who does not understand how the world economy works. And you are happy to exploit people - slave labor even as the Chinese employ it - to have your cheap electronics. The current world economy was set up this way by people, not by some immutable law.
And I dare you to show me how Trump screwed things up. You are just talking out of your posterior. In fact the economy was booming under Mr. Trump and his policies. If you are honest you will have to admit that. He restored some balance to the world economic order.
You should be careful about accusing others of not understanding things, as you clearly fail in that regard yourself.
Sebastian Clay Kinsey you say:
"He's no businessman. He's a con-man & a scam artist. Every "business" he's had has either been a scam, or a ploy he kept temporarily alive by bankfraud, ripping off partners.... or in a few cases, something he drive into the ground sheer stupidity, greed & business practices that made him the laughing stock of the comnercial world."
Do you have Trump's wealth? Is your networth his equal? Amazing how a guy who is so stupid in your mind has done so much better than you!
Trump has built buildings all over the world. He's built resorts and golf courses. How many have you built?
Trump has built multiple major corporations. https://www.investopedia.com/updates/donald-trump-companies/ How many corporations do you own?
You may call it a scam but he's done more than just go on Congressional junkets and make speeches. I understand; I did not support Trump when he was running and still think him a bit of a braying jackass. But he won me over with his policies - not his words. You seem to hate him just because you hate him.
You say a country is not a business. First, I would like your actual evidence. You say it is like a family. It is not even close to a family (unless one is involved in an abusive, loveless family.) Actually, your use of "country" is interesting; we aren't talking about the COUNTRY so much as the government, which you seem to equate. The government runs very much like a business. The problems we've had with bad government is that the people running it have no business experience and unlimited budgets, meaning they do not have to worry about unintended consequences of their profligate actions. Biden - the ultimate insider and politician - does not worry about spending trillions of dollars. Nor does he worry about the consequences of, say, telling people there will be no deportations. He isn't held accountable. A businessman would be and his head would roll if he screwed up even remotely as badly as Mr. Biden has done.
"The employment lies Trump would tout, fell into his lap... " Uh, what "lies" were those? That the country was booming? That black employment and hispanic employment were at record highs? You are stretching here.
Your claim Obama somehow turned the tide on this is ludicrous; during his entire tenure we had virtually no growth (which, I might add, was policy; it's part of the idea of "sustainability" which means no economic growth, and the Obama people were telling us higher unemployment was the "new norm" and they openly mocked Trump for saying we could have higher growth rates, or perhaps you have forgotten.)
"the trickledown fantasy you believe in had been proven time & time again to be a con-job." Oh really? How about some proof to back that claim up. You guys like to spout off that shibboleth but you have no evidence to prove it.
Most economic failures have come because of governement intervention in the economy (like the Clinton DOJ suing Microsoft and popping the tech bubble, which started the real estate bubble, which was propelled by government using the Community Reinvestment Act to force banks and lenders to make bad loans) and increased taxation. The high corporate taxes, for example, drive businesses out of the U.S. It has nothing to do with "trickle down" economics, which is a poor description of how markets work anyway. It is rather a rising tide, with businesses having more money to hire more people. It's worked every time it's been tried. Keynsian stupidity has failed every time. Look at the length of the Great Depression as proof of that, or look at Stagflation during the
'70's under Carter. In fact, Carter lost in a landslide to Reagan because of Keynsianism, and Reagan used "trickle down" to ignite the economy. Every time it's been tried it works, from Warren Harding and Coolige getting us out of the depression of 1921 to Eisenhower, to Reagan to Trump. I defy you to give an example of our taxing our way to prosperity.
Your post turned into a rather crazy, unsupportable rant at the end, by the way. It's all "evil corporations" and the like. Well, those evil corporations are supporting Democrats, in case you missed it. Almost all billionaires are staunch Democrats. If rich guys are so terrible why do they support your party?
Uh, and Christian schools actually do better than the horrible public education you tout. Perhaps you missed that.
You say "You want a successful nation? Take care of the middlec class" That is exactly what Trump was doing. And it is what you and yours are not. The middle class has been squeezed by globalism, by the destruction of industries that employed them, but high taxes and the lack of jobs via corporate taxes. If we listen to you we will have NO middle class. The middle class declined most during the Clinton and Obama years, in case you are unaware. See here https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/incomes-fall-and-poverty-rises-under-obama-census-report/ here https://www.ibtimes.com/political-capital/presidents-obama-clinton-failed-defend-middle-class-robert-reich-2621714 and here https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-obama-economy-idUSKBN0KR0HD20150118 for just three articles about the matter I turned up with the greatest of ease (and you could too if you weren't lazy.)
In a discussion on Facebook a guy named Sebastian Clay Kinsey makes the following claim about taxation, claiming it won't drive business away:
Republican short-sightedness. Any company that leaves will be instantly replaced by a new one, especially with a population full of cash to go spend on a daily basis. Repubs always think one-step ahead & nothing more.
I replied:
Sebastian Clay Kinsey history proves you wrong; just look at how many corporations left during the NAFTA era. You have a nice faculty lounge theory but the real world explodes it.
David Redfern replies:
Where were all these 'replacement' businesses to fill the holes when US manufacturers went to China?
Where's the equivalent Apple, Dell, IBM and Motorola factories producing phones, laptops and TV's?
Where are all the textile manufacturers to replace those that moved production to India and China?
Then there's white goods and kitchen appliances. Whirlpool imported 2,368 different products from China in 2019/2020.
Why would a US business not take advantage of Chinese wages which are pennies on the dollar? Especially when they have to pay exorbitant corporation Taxes.
socialists can't think one step ahead.
Mr. Kinsey says:
David Redfern... you don't understand how these things work. It's a theory of specialization.
David Redfern replies:
You said it mate: "It's a theory of specialization.
Clearly you have not read Adam Smith who was amongst the first, and by far and away the most famous to quantify the concept of specialisation.
It's nothing new, as Matt Ridley points out in his book The rational Optimist. Mankind began specialising shortly after discovering the concept of free trade.
This is not a 1950's concept, nor an 1850's, 1650's or 1150's concept; it goes back to the dawn of time, when a guy realised he was a lousy fisherman, but could make great hooks. He teamed up with a guy who could fish but was a lousy hook maker. They specialised, traded and prospered. The concept is not unique to fishing of course.
The concept can be traced back through time by Anthropologists
It can also be applied to every single manufacturer and profitable trading operation throughout the world, over time, including the present day. It all works on the same principle.
Trump understands the concept intimately because he is a businessmen. Biden, the Clintons and Bernie don't understand it because they have been politicians all their life and have never had a real job in that time. And to be fair, most career politicians are the same.
What did Trump do to "hobble future tech, modern energy production, educating our public to perform 1st world tasks, etc..."?
He encouraged businesses to return to the US by lowering Corporation Tax so jobs would be created. That increases receipts from income, local and purchase Taxes, and all the benefits to society that cascade from that like infrastructure improvement.
And what modern energy sources are you referring to. Trump was a supporter of Nuclear power and was taking an active interest in SMR's (Small Modular Reactors) an energy source even the most committed green, Michael Shellenberger, supports in his recent book Apocalypse Never (Why Environmental Alarmism Hurts Us All).
As for education, Trump was attempting to improve educational choice, supported home schooling, and was attempting to hand authority back to individual states for education that reflected their regional priorities instead of the one size fits all, centralised DC governance. This required an overhaul of the Carl D. Perkins Career and Technical Education Act. Spending $1.2 billion on a program last overhauled by Congress in 2006. His Title I aid was typically directed at low-income students.
Trump improved employment and wages across Women, Blacks, Hispanics and Asians. More Tax receipts for the country from participants utterly ignored by Obama. Again, another theorist career politician with no understanding of Free Trade because he had never encountered it before.
Trumps only mistake was the vocalisation of his desire to Drain The Swamp. It had every corrupt politician from both sides of the house mounting smear campaigns against him via the MSM who were in on the Swamp up to their armpits.
Like any other country on the planet, America is a giant business. Who better to get it functioning properly than a demonstrably effective businessman? Certainly not a bunch of Crony Capitalist politicians desperate to milk the country for as much as possible, for as long as possible.
David Redfern... first off, not a bad post. But Trump is the antithesis off what he cons people into thinking. He's no businessman. He's a con-man & a scam artist. Every "business" he's had has either been a scam, or a ploy he kept temporarily alive by bankfraud, ripping off partners.... or in a few cases, something he drive into the ground sheer stupidity, greed & business practices that made him the laughing stock of the comercial world. A country is NOT A BUSINESS.... this idea is the most absurd concept. I've heard it for years and it's just rubbish. A country is somewhat similar to a family.... and almost nothing like a business in actuality. The employment lies Trump would tout, fell into his lap... so like any con-man, he tried to sell them as his doing. 8 years of pro-middle class polÃcies is what turned the tidev in that direction - the trickledown fantasy you believe in had been proven time & time again to be a con-job. Half these corporations weasel out of taxes & pay Trump-like cronies (his entire crooked admin of thieves & pay to play criminals) to bypass all regulations in place to create SUSTAINABLE growth... not the smash & grab thievery we saw under that orange sociopath. Corporate taxes were already the lowest in the developed world, while the middle class is underwater & getting worse. Trumps education idea was basic... give it over to that Trump donor, DeVos... and her criminal billionaire family so they could profiteer off of private scamsc posing as education... sucking cash out of American tax payers to line their own pockets, promote Christian schools of nonsense, and leave American youth further behind the rest of the world more & more every day.
You bought into these lying, scum thieves. Yeah, politics isn't perfect... but I'll take the average 15% liar instead of the 99% liar any day of the week. Politics is complicated... there's a REASON career politicians exist. You think an army of corrupt scum is your salvation bcuz they're willing to lie to you non-stop & tell you what you want to hear, while robbing you blind from the back. Good lord dude.... do you think it's a coincidence that everyone that knows Trump hates his guts eventually? It ain't bcuz he's "calling it like it is". I'd vote for you as president a million times before that orange painted monster. You may be incorrect about everything but unlike Trump, you prolly genuinely care & would figure stuff out as you went. You want a successful nation? Take care of the middlec class... and the rest of it happens naturally.
(Editor's note: notice how desperate this guy has become since David pinned him? He is now ranting.)
David retorts:
And yet, Trump managed to build hotels etc. across the world with people who evidently trust him.
Trust is an inherent part of business, without a reputation for delivering, no one will deal with you.
Had Trump been as unscrupulous as you maintain, no one would do business with him. Yours is just typical TDS, you don't like the man (nor did I) and are unwilling to face facts (I am).
How does a family survive if not through running its own micro business. 'Money in' must exceed 'money out' or the family goes bust and loses their home, car and all their worldly goods.
Manage a families finances well and you are running a small business, even down to the individual level.
A country is no different. Money in must exceed money out to realise a profit and a healthy balance of trade. Trump was bringing business back home so the balance of trade would shift back to the US and positively influence that money in/money out equation.
There is no other way of dealing with national debt other than by following those simple rules.
socialists and politicians in general don't understand how to achieve this fundamental equation, that's why far too many countries are wallowing in debt.
I have been forced to explain the concept of specialisation to you, must I really be forced to school you on the function of the most basic economics?
The rest of your post is just an unsubstantiated
Trump put together the clearest pre election manifesto I have ever seen, basically bullet point of promises he made to his voters. And unlike any politician before or since, he began ticking them off one by one. This is the reason I changed my mind about him. You can accuse him of what you want but at the very least he was honest with the people that voted for him and kept his promises as best he could.
Try examining any other politicians pre election manifesto, if they even produce a written copy by which they can be measured. They are without exception, vague nonsense wrapped up in reams of garbage telling people more about what they can't achieve rather than what they can.
Trump was also the most peaceful POTUS in living memory. All of his predecessors began at least one new international conflict in their first term. Trump started none.
By comparison, Trump faced down the N. Koreans and was admired by Putin as someone not to fuck with. And remember, this is Russia, the biggest country on earth by far, which abandoned communism for Capitalism yet has been demonised somehow, as a pariah state. Trump and Putin had one thing in common, an inherent distrust of the Chinese and a Democratic Russia could have been one of America's greatest allies. Contrast that with the utter disdain Putin treated Obama with, it was palpable in their recorded meetings. I have a friend who has lived in Russia for 30 years who confirms all this.
Furthermore, during Trumps tenure there was no unrest in the Middle east between Israel and Palestine. Indeed, Trump was in the midst of agreeing a monumental peace deal, notably by excluding Palestine from negotiations. Something no other peace deal has attempted or achieved.
Within weeks of Biden taken office he lifted monetary sanctions on Iran, handing them $billions, and the Palestinians attacked Israel. Coincidence? Not a chance.
Going from the sublime to the ridiculous, after Biden insulted Putin by acknowledging his as a 'killer', he was mocked by Putin who challenged him to a stair climbing competition and a public debate, both of which Biden declined with feeble excuses.
Biden betrayed 11,000 pipeline workers on his first day by sacking them. That wasn't in his pre election manifesto, was it? Now the country faces the prospect of returning to transporting Oil by trains and Warren Buffett is a major player in the railroad side of oil-by-rail. Berkshire Hathaway has full ownership of BNSF Railway Company, and BNSF is the biggest railroad player in the Bakken oil region.
Tell me that's not Crony Capitalism and that only 15% of sleepy Joe was lying.
But Trump said hurty things on Twitter.
FFS get some perspective.
I retort:
Sebastian Clay Kinsey you say "Republican efforts to hobble future tech, modern energy production, educating our public to perform 1st world tasks, etc"
How so? Where have the Republicans hobbled "future tech?" It is the Democrats who promote old technology like windmills. And solar, well, it doesn't really work and the Chinese own the materials needed to make solar power right now. I do not think you can support that claim. The Republicans favor nuclear and fracking for energy. The Republicans also are the ones who favor actual STEM education and not promote "Woke" theories like Math being racist. Or did you miss that?
What you call "short sighted" is an attempt to avoid wasting time and money and brains on foolish ideas like sustainability, or intersectionality.
The fact is we have lost a good deal of industry to China because of bad political decisions. It was decided in the '90's that China would be the industrial heart and the U.S. the tech sector. Well, a tech sector is wonderful but you still need to be able to actually make stuff, which is what the modern thinking fails to take into account. As long as you have to buy from overseas you are vulnerable, as the last twenty years SHOULD have taught us.
Rare Earth metals are a case in point. The Chinese have cornered the market on them. Now if we want to make all that dandy solar and wind stuff we have to go hat in hand to China.
I would add that we can manufacture things here in America that are better than what the Chinese are making, which means people will buy them even if they cost a bit more. You assume there is no difference in quality between what we and they produce. It's not true. I own a television that was made 100% in America and it was not considerably more expensive than a foreign made one. It's a lot better. People will choose quality if given the chance.
And the model of exporting jobs to Third World countries is not "sustainable" insofar as it will always lead to a search for cheaper and cheaper labor to exploit. The end result is the rise of the megacorporation and multinational entities and the demise of smaller local companies. This is terrible destructive.
Overly cheap labor is destructive. Slavery in the antebellum south proved that; it depressed wages in industries outside of those where slaves predominated (like cotton). There was a reason the old south was dirt poor except a few very wealthy planters and the like. By promoting China and other such serf labor we are guaranteeing a depression of American wages. There are only so many new tech jobs to go around. And what makes you think these tech jobs wont wind up being outsourced?
Why has Japan been in such bad economic shape for the last twenty years? In the '80's they were expected to be the big economic powerhouse. They did what you are proposing, went "high tech" and let the fundamentals slide. You have to make stuff to have a balanced economy. Fail to do that and you are at the mercy of others who can outbid you.
I fear YOU are the one who does not understand how the world economy works. And you are happy to exploit people - slave labor even as the Chinese employ it - to have your cheap electronics. The current world economy was set up this way by people, not by some immutable law.
And I dare you to show me how Trump screwed things up. You are just talking out of your posterior. In fact the economy was booming under Mr. Trump and his policies. If you are honest you will have to admit that. He restored some balance to the world economic order.
You should be careful about accusing others of not understanding things, as you clearly fail in that regard yourself.
Sebastian Clay Kinsey you say:
"He's no businessman. He's a con-man & a scam artist. Every "business" he's had has either been a scam, or a ploy he kept temporarily alive by bankfraud, ripping off partners.... or in a few cases, something he drive into the ground sheer stupidity, greed & business practices that made him the laughing stock of the comnercial world."
Do you have Trump's wealth? Is your networth his equal? Amazing how a guy who is so stupid in your mind has done so much better than you!
Trump has built buildings all over the world. He's built resorts and golf courses. How many have you built?
Trump has built multiple major corporations. https://www.investopedia.com/updates/donald-trump-companies/ How many corporations do you own?
You may call it a scam but he's done more than just go on Congressional junkets and make speeches. I understand; I did not support Trump when he was running and still think him a bit of a braying jackass. But he won me over with his policies - not his words. You seem to hate him just because you hate him.
You say a country is not a business. First, I would like your actual evidence. You say it is like a family. It is not even close to a family (unless one is involved in an abusive, loveless family.) Actually, your use of "country" is interesting; we aren't talking about the COUNTRY so much as the government, which you seem to equate. The government runs very much like a business. The problems we've had with bad government is that the people running it have no business experience and unlimited budgets, meaning they do not have to worry about unintended consequences of their profligate actions. Biden - the ultimate insider and politician - does not worry about spending trillions of dollars. Nor does he worry about the consequences of, say, telling people there will be no deportations. He isn't held accountable. A businessman would be and his head would roll if he screwed up even remotely as badly as Mr. Biden has done.
"The employment lies Trump would tout, fell into his lap... " Uh, what "lies" were those? That the country was booming? That black employment and hispanic employment were at record highs? You are stretching here.
Your claim Obama somehow turned the tide on this is ludicrous; during his entire tenure we had virtually no growth (which, I might add, was policy; it's part of the idea of "sustainability" which means no economic growth, and the Obama people were telling us higher unemployment was the "new norm" and they openly mocked Trump for saying we could have higher growth rates, or perhaps you have forgotten.)
"the trickledown fantasy you believe in had been proven time & time again to be a con-job." Oh really? How about some proof to back that claim up. You guys like to spout off that shibboleth but you have no evidence to prove it.
Most economic failures have come because of governement intervention in the economy (like the Clinton DOJ suing Microsoft and popping the tech bubble, which started the real estate bubble, which was propelled by government using the Community Reinvestment Act to force banks and lenders to make bad loans) and increased taxation. The high corporate taxes, for example, drive businesses out of the U.S. It has nothing to do with "trickle down" economics, which is a poor description of how markets work anyway. It is rather a rising tide, with businesses having more money to hire more people. It's worked every time it's been tried. Keynsian stupidity has failed every time. Look at the length of the Great Depression as proof of that, or look at Stagflation during the
'70's under Carter. In fact, Carter lost in a landslide to Reagan because of Keynsianism, and Reagan used "trickle down" to ignite the economy. Every time it's been tried it works, from Warren Harding and Coolige getting us out of the depression of 1921 to Eisenhower, to Reagan to Trump. I defy you to give an example of our taxing our way to prosperity.
Your post turned into a rather crazy, unsupportable rant at the end, by the way. It's all "evil corporations" and the like. Well, those evil corporations are supporting Democrats, in case you missed it. Almost all billionaires are staunch Democrats. If rich guys are so terrible why do they support your party?
Uh, and Christian schools actually do better than the horrible public education you tout. Perhaps you missed that.
You say "You want a successful nation? Take care of the middlec class" That is exactly what Trump was doing. And it is what you and yours are not. The middle class has been squeezed by globalism, by the destruction of industries that employed them, but high taxes and the lack of jobs via corporate taxes. If we listen to you we will have NO middle class. The middle class declined most during the Clinton and Obama years, in case you are unaware. See here https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/incomes-fall-and-poverty-rises-under-obama-census-report/ here https://www.ibtimes.com/political-capital/presidents-obama-clinton-failed-defend-middle-class-robert-reich-2621714 and here https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-obama-economy-idUSKBN0KR0HD20150118 for just three articles about the matter I turned up with the greatest of ease (and you could too if you weren't lazy.)
Posted by: Timothy Birdnow at
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This was a strange experience to hear people don’t find what they order. If something makes it done too good to be true, it is airydress legit. I ordered several "woven" and "linen" clothes from online stores, not expecting a lot for the price, but I do expect, at least, cotton and linen should be with great fabric. Every item was made from a strange nylon-like material at the quality of the fabric.
Posted by: Steward ken at June 20, 2021 06:41 AM (Cufkp)
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If only people could think twice before saying anything. Or could analyze economics. Sometimes, thoughts are not making any point unless they are uttered and put into a coherent speech https://essaydune.com/write-my-speech/ examples. Look at corporate business universities and their influence on research and progress.
Posted by: Jason Shrumm at July 15, 2021 04:12 AM (0j/Ib)
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